Druids: Their Holy Days: Samhain pt. 2 Taliesin_2 shane@cais.com Tue May 12 23:57:20 1998 <Proins`eaf> Samhain was when the last of the harvest was brought in*br*<ScottW> Ross Nichol's book is largely drawn from sources other than those Celtic -- it represents a 200 year old *modern* Druidic tradition.*br*<Taliesin_2> Agreed. But it is a intersting read..*br*<Myrriah> I have to agree with Scott that not everything is Wiccan, even though I claim this as my main belief :-)*br*<ScottW> According to NIchols (who worked out the 8 fold festival scheme with Gerald Gardener) the soltices and equinoxs (sun festivals) were Druidic, the fire festivals Wiccan.*br*<Proins`eaf> the Fire festivals are celtic*br*<Proins`eaf> not wicca*br*<ScottW> This illustrates the common idea that Druid = male = sun, Wiccan = female = land/night*br*<Steelclaw> According to some books I've read Druidry is much older than Wicca...most stems from Druidry, though some has branched off from there.*br*<Proins`eaf> the celts celebreated the 4 fire festivels*br*<ScottW> I know that Proins -- that is why I wouldn't take Nichols work to seriously.*br*Taliesin_2 has kicked IceWa1ker from #The_Druids'_Grove (You have recieved your verbal warning, now you get kicked.)*br*<MysticWlf> Scott: but druids did have females too..they just seperated them...*br*<Proins`eaf> oh sorry, misunderstood*br*<Proins`eaf> no they didnt sepreat them*br*<MysticWlf> they were still called druids, bards, etc..*br*IceWa1ker-AFK is now known as IceWa1ker*br*<MysticWlf> they seperated the way the were taught and what they were taught to my understanding*br*<VitMonx> But I am not talking paths - Guess I'm confused - thought we were talking soltices not harvest or cycle days*br*<MysticWlf> males were taught differently and w/ different context*br*<Proins`eaf> that is inncorret*br*<ScottW> I know that Wolf -- I'm stating the common belief Nichols puts forth -- I don't agree with it. I'm citing it as a reason not to take everything (or almost anything) in that book at face value!*br*<Taliesin_2> A interesting tidbit: female Druids were belived to have been called Dryads*br*<Proins`eaf> stuff taught in 21 lession of Merlin*br*<Proins`eaf> female druids are BanDraoi*br*<Taliesin_2> But at the same time Dryads are sprites*br*<Myrriah> Why was there a difference?*br*<Proins`eaf> that is Ancient Irish*br*<MysticWlf> scott: *nods* i was not being offensive...just stating something...*br*<ScottW> Dryad is a term for a forest sprite (female) -- it has nothing to do with Druidry. That is a romantic assocaition.*br*<ScottW> Thats oka, Wolf -- not offended!*br*<ScottW> BRB*br*<Taliesin_2> ok*br*<ScottW> That was short -- back.*br*<Myrriah> Me neither offended, just wondering why the differnce.*br*<Taliesin_2> :)*br*<ScottW> "Druidry" has ben many things to many different people.*br*<ScottW> The common portrayal of Druidry (much of which we've already seen surface in discussion) really has very little to do with anything Celtic.*br*<Steelclaw> Scott> I agree*br*<Taliesin_2> First off let me say something: The 21 Lessions of Merlyn by Douglas Monroe is a book NOT to be read.*br*<Proins`eaf> modern Druid has almost nothing to do with the celts*br*<MysticWlf> myrriah: off had i don't remember, they believed that men were superior i think...(dont quote me on that) by superior i mean the alpha...*br*<Steelclaw> Tal> That was the first book I read. A lot of it was worthless, but it was interesting none the less*br*<Proins`eaf> I TOTALY agree Tal*br*<Taliesin_2> It is a book of made up fantasy, but a interesting read*br*<Myrriah> LOL I have taht book Tal! And thanks Mystic, of course, history would tell us so at that time that women were inferior, but I was just wondering what your take on it was.*br*<Taliesin_2> Plus, remember that even lies can be based upon truths*br*<MysticWlf> i found the Prologue very fascinating myself*br*<Steelclaw> So what does one do on Samhain...how do ya'll celebrate it?*br*<Myrriah> The only book by the way I have on Druid. LOL!*br*<Taliesin_2> He unfortunately has a new book coming out called The Lost Books of Merlyn*br*ScottW [webber@na1p45.ark.com] has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer)*br*<Proins`eaf> Celtic woman had it better then other women of there day, how ever, they where far from equal*br*<MysticWlf> yes, i've heard..it's the sequel*br*<Taliesin_2> Agreed Proins*br*<Steelclaw> Tal...is that going to be the same fictional stuff or better?*br*<Taliesin_2> While I doubt it, I hope hes done some research for this book*br*<Taliesin_2> Couldn't say Steel.*br*<MysticWlf> i wouldn't recommend NOT reading 21 lessons, but i wouldn't say believe everything you read, either!! It's one of those gut things again.*br*<Steelclaw> I'll probably read it anyhow..just to see. Besides, I'm a fiction lover...I don't take anything as truth easily*br*ScottW [webber@na1p46.ark.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> wb*br*<MysticWlf> welcome back ScottW*br*<IceWa1ker> that darned peer !!*br*ScottW [webber@na1p46.ark.com] has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)*br*ScottW [webber@na1p46.ark.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*ScottW 's dad used the line for a fax... got kicked.*br*<MysticWlf> Talie: anyhow, i think we should get back to the question of steelclaw, "what to do to celebrate samhain?"*br*<ScottW> Where did we leave off...?*br*<IceWa1ker> :-)*br*<Steelclaw> I'm definitely curious =)*br*<MysticWlf> hmmm...believe i spelled that wrong too...<?>*br*<Taliesin_2> I think it might be best decided by the individual*br*<Steelclaw> Nah...that was right.*br*ScottW thinks that the best questions to ask before "what do we do?" are "what are the key elements of the festival?" and "why was it done in the past?"*br*<Steelclaw> Hmm...doesn't help me any. Is there any "traditional" way? I've read very little on it'*br*Proins`eaf [raven@1Cust20.tnt6.redmond.wa.da.uu.net] has quit IRC (Quit: where there is no truth,there is NO honor)*br*<Myrriah> I would like to know what the difference between the Druid celebration and Wiccan is, Tal, on Samhain??? <g>*br*<ScottW> There are no rituals of any substances that have survived, so we really don't know. There are some folk traditions, though.*br*<Taliesin_2> I think it important to allow individual insiration or imbas*br*<MysticWlf> steel: perhaps..reading more will extend your knowledge of it and give you an answer...opening two doors w/ one key :)*br*<ScottW> I agree with you, Shane, but I think it is just as improtant to know why you call it "samhain," besides the neat name.*br*<Taliesin_2> Myrriah, i am not too sure about that one...*br*<Taliesin_2> Any offerers?*br*<Steelclaw> Mystic...I'm working on it :) Just donj't have a lot of knowledge at the moment.*br*<ScottW> We don't know what the original druids did. Modern Druids vay as much as modern Wiccans.*br*<ScottW> vay = vary*br*<MysticWlf> wiccans do what they feel is right...*br*<Taliesin_2> np Scott*br*<IceWa1ker> does not Samhain simply mean "years end" or words to that effect?*br*<MysticWlf> or comfortable*br*<Taliesin_2> More or less, Ice.*br*<ScottW> "summer's end"*br*<Myrriah> I can say what I do but I am Wiccan and so this is how I see it, this is my New year, I dress for the ocassion to mirror what I want to convey through the year, I feast, after fasting for three days, I scrym ready Tarot for the New year and talk to the ancestors, as well as remember the ancesotors.*br*<Myrriah> Forgive the typos!*br*<Taliesin_2> np, we all do it,*br*<MysticWlf> I've taken many years of typo...i can translate, myrriah :)*br*<Steelclaw> So where does Morrigan fit into the picture if this represents the new year?*br*<Taliesin_2> I also think the way we celebrate it depends on the Druid Order & how they teach [riual] it. As well as Wiccan Trads*br*<ScottW> I think the Morrigan may have mated with the Dagda at Samhain, but I'm not sure.*br*<ScottW> I agree with Shane.*br*<Taliesin_2> The summer/autumn ends a time of life & growth*br*<Steelclaw> Doesn't help for us solitary druids. *shrug**br*<VitMonx> What I have read is that the name Samhain probably comes from Aryan God odf death, Samana or Gaelic samhraidhreadh - summer end*br*<ScottW> The main difference between Druids (of a Celtic leaning -- i.e. not OBOD, ADF, etc.) and Wiccans is that the Druid ritual is likely to incorporate a lot more Celtic imagery, and be basewd on a Celtic worldview/cosmology rather than a Wiccan one -- there are huge differences.*br*<Taliesin_2> the winter represents loss & death of plant life.*br*<IceWa1ker> SteelClaw: nothing wrong at all with researching what others are doing and seeing what feels right or appropriate for you*br*<ScottW> I've never heard Samain portrayed as a god of death. The translation I have conmes from the Coligny calendar (an archaeological find) on which Samonios (Old Gaulish for "summer's end") is inscribed.*br*<Taliesin_2> It is believed in Wicca at Samhain the God dies & the Goddess becomes impregnated with the God to be born in the Spring*br*<Taliesin_2> Myrriah, any corrections needed?*br*<Taliesin_2> Yes, but the Coligny Calendar is a creation of Robert Graves who wrote the book "The White Goddess"*br*<Taliesin_2> And that book is to be taken with grain of salt as well*br*<Taliesin_2> >sigh< So few [good] books out there...*br*<Taliesin_2> Thoughts? Questions? Comments?*br*IceWa1ker [danu@ppp-194.nunanet.com] has quit IRC (toronto.on.ca.dal.net raptor.ab.ca.dal.net)*br*Steelclaw [steelclaw@dialup-200.apex2000.net] has quit IRC (indy.in.us.dal.net arlington.va.us.dal.net)*br*MysticWlf [~Mystical@158.5.14.28] has quit IRC (viper.mo.us.dal.net stlouis.mo.us.dal.net)*br*Myrriah [~myrriah@as5200-1-41.cnb.mn.frontiernet.net] has quit IRC (indy.in.us.dal.net opus.bc.ca.dal.net)*br*ScottW [webber@na1p46.ark.com] has quit IRC (trapdoor.ca.us.dal.net spider.ca.us.dal.net)*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has quit IRC (trapdoor.ca.us.dal.net spider.ca.us.dal.net)*br*Taliesin_2: *NETSPLIT* *br*Steelclaw [steelclaw@dialup-200.apex2000.net] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*MysticWlf [~Mystical@158.5.14.28] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*Myrriah [~myrriah@as5200-1-41.cnb.mn.frontiernet.net] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*Taliesin_2 says Helllllllloooooooo in a erie voice....*br*<Taliesin_2> wb all*br*<Taliesin_2> netsplit*br*<Taliesin_2> Thoughts? Questions? Comments?*br*<Taliesin_2> brb*br*IceWa1ker [danu@ppp-194.nunanet.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*ScottW [webber@na1p46.ark.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*ChanServ sets mode: +o Taliesin_2 *br*<Taliesin_2> wb*br*<ScottW> I don't think the burning times had anything to do with Wicca. Wicca the monder religion didn't even exist back then. Most people killed during the burning times were Christian. Herbalists, midwifes, etc. were the closest thing to Wiccans, and much different.*br*<MysticWlf> welcome back taliesin_2*br*<Myrriah> Yes it has, and truth be told I am not Wiccan but British trad, taught by my family. But I never said you were attacking me or Wicca I am sorry if it sounded that way. I use the kabbalah to call quarters, but do not teach it yet,*br*<ScottW> re Shane.*br*<IceWa1ker> wb Tal*br*<Steelclaw> Sorry guys...I gotta go.*br*<IceWa1ker> later Steelclaw .. nice meeting you*br*<Steelclaw> U too <G>*br*<Steelclaw> Sorry..getting busy on my end. *br*<ScottW> British Trad. and the original Wicca are essentially the same thing. Wicca grew out of British Trad. which itself grew mostly out of the Western Mystery Tradition -- Freemansonry, Xtian mysticism, etc.*br*<Steelclaw> Tal...can I catch you later for the log?*br*<ScottW> Oi/che Mhaith.*br*<Myrriah> Sorry guys but I hear alot of stuff on the net about Fluff and when i feel i am being called that I will reply. :-) Forgive OK?*br*<MysticWlf> yes, scott, but wicca did exist back then (i strongly believe) that is the main reason for the change. After the burning times, wicca was invented or created if you will so that it would NOT happen again...*br*<ScottW> Forgiven -- never felt you were being unreasonable at all.*br*<ScottW> I strongly (!!!!!!!!!) disagree!*br*<MysticWlf> i shouldn't say wicca existed back then...it existed after the burning times..but the effect of the times made the religion...*br*Steelclaw [steelclaw@dialup-200.apex2000.net] has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)*br*<Myrriah> Scott :-)*br*<ScottW> Wicca proper didn't exist until in 30s.*br*<Myrriah> True Mystic, it existed before then also, but it is not Wicca in every sense of the word, as Wicca came later.*br*<ScottW> The inquisition led to a time of religious unpheaval, as people began to doubt the church, but it wasn't until much later that things mytsical and agical became popular.*br*<ScottW> It is naive in the extreme to simplify history to such an etent so as to say that the burning times = the devlopment of Wicca.*br*<ScottW> The biggest difference between modern Wicca and what existed beforehand is that modern Wicca is a *religion* whereas what existed before was mostly folk belief. Wicca is very much a philosophical (and metaphysical) constrcut of the 19th and 20th centuries.*br*<ScottW> The average pagan was very different from the average Wiccan. The beleif system, the whole way of looking at the world must ahve been very different.*br*<Taliesin_2> Be right back. changing servers*br**** Log file closed: 5/12/98 9:51:43 PM*p**** Log file opened: 5/12/98 9:52:29 PM*br*Taliesin_2 [~shane@shane.cais.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*ChanServ sets mode: +o Taliesin_2 *br*<ScottW> I'm not quite sure what you are saying, Myrriah...*br*<MysticWlf> i dunno, myrriah, it is very likely...*br*<Taliesin_2> ok. can we get back on topic?*br*<Myrriah> I'm sorry if I am rambling <g>*br*MysticWlf nods....noone agrees so let's get back on the original topic*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer)*br*<Taliesin_2> I promise you this everybody: After the chats of the holy days we discuss the burning times*br*<ScottW> Although there were ceratinly religions that had important female deities, thought in a circular way, placed importance on the lreationship between the divine masucline and divine feminine, the metaphysical and philosophical constructs that udnerlie the basics of Wicca are *modern*.*br*<Myrriah> :-) Mystic*br*<MysticWlf> one more thing, scott, you keep stating wicca *modern* and wicca....are there 2 wiccas?*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> wb*br*MysticWlf isn't being sarcastic...he really wants to know*br*<VitMonx> thanks*br*<Taliesin_2> OK, Samhain*br*<Taliesin_2> Food & Drink:*br*Myrriah [~myrriah@as5200-1-41.cnb.mn.frontiernet.net] has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)*br*<MysticWlf> go on please, taliesin...*br*<ScottW> No (and then we should really get back to the original topic!). Wicca is a modern religion. Some people think it exsited before it existed in name, but I disagree, seeing no real evidence, or continuation of ancient belief systems or practice. (now I'll shut up!).*br*<IceWa1ker> harvest type foods*br*<Taliesin_2> What are traditional Food & Drink at the elebration?*br*<ScottW> Likely whatever was around. Most likely some cattle would be sacrificed, possibly to be eaten. Modern Celtic pagans mught choose salmon (the fish of wisdom). Boar/Pork would also be appropriate (re: Wlesh tale associated with this time of year).*br*<MysticWlf> scott: hey, don't be angry and DONT shut up...this is discussion...arguments and debates take place...it's common and very normal...if not i would really worry :)*br*OmniSurfer [~klajn@dialin-004.asgard.net.au] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<MysticWlf> g'day omnisurfer*br*<OmniSurfer> Hi mysticWlf*br*<Taliesin_2> Greetings OmniSurfer*br*<OmniSurfer> Greeting Taliesin_2*br*<ScottW> Wold -- the moderator asked me to get back on topic -- not angry, just recognizing that this could go on forever and we need some closure.*br*<ScottW> There are better essays than what I could present, anyway. I'm not Wiccan and don't totally udnerstand its "mysteries."*br*<ScottW> or histories.*br*<VitMonx> mp all*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has quit IRC (Quit: going - going - GONE!!!)*br*ScottW will really shut up now.*br*IceWa1ker is interested in the association with boar/pork ... as wellas the Welsh tale*br*<MysticWlf> hehe...ok scottw...but only shut up about wicca..:)*br*ScottW is mostly an Irish guy and will have to dig up the deatils on the Welsh tale... hold on a sec.*br*<Taliesin_2> Wicca isn't the topic. Wicca & The Burning Times will be discussed as a topic after the Holy Days chats end*br*<OmniSurfer> Is a Druid a Wiccan? - I know nothing - that's why I'm here to know more about Druids.*br*<IceWa1ker> no Omni ... 2 different belief structures*br*<MysticWlf> omni: i believe i druid can share wiccan beliefs..yes...*br*<MysticWlf> but it is my belief*br*<MysticWlf> but a druid is a strong word...*br*<MysticWlf> you can't just say, "im a druid"*br*<MysticWlf> cause you won't be*br*<MysticWlf> :)*br*<Taliesin_2> Wiccans tend to combine all aspect of the Goddess & God into one... icon as it were*br*<MysticWlf> i'm sorry for the distraction, talie, please continue...this is intriguing*br*<Taliesin_2> While Druids tend to worship a whole pantheon of Deities.*br*<Taliesin_2> NP Mystic.*br*<MysticWlf> but to be blunt and answer your question, omni: no a druid is not a wiccan...in my belief that is...*br*<Taliesin_2> What are traditional Food & Drink at the elebration?*br*<Taliesin_2> What are traditional Food & Drink at the celebration of Samhain?*br*<IceWa1ker> I prefer harvest type foods, lots of veggies.... asked about pork as that is something that just "came to be" in our house but I'm not sure why it did*br*<Taliesin_2> Please drop the topic of Wicca. It will be discussed in a later chat. Thank you.*br*<ScottW> Welsh tale -- "The Pusuit of Dairmuid and Gra/inne"*br*<Taliesin_2> What about Scott?*br*MysticWlf [~Mystical@158.5.14.28] has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer)*br*<ScottW> Gra/inne is supposed to wed Fionn Mac Cumhail, but persuades Diarmuid to elope with her.*br*SolarFlame [~Mystical@158.5.14.28] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<ScottW> Diamuid is killed while hunting in the form of a magic boar (at Samhain).*br*SolarFlame is now known as MysticWlf*br*<Taliesin_2> wb*br*<MysticWlf> thank you*br*<ScottW> This killing results from an argument (actually, maritial dispute). Donn (Diarmuid's father) kills his wife's child of another man. That man turns the dead child into a boar which kills Diarmuid. Only Fionn could save Diarmuid, but doesn't becuase Diarmuid stole (or was stolen by!) his wife to be, Gra/inne.*br*<Taliesin_2> U, are we done discussing Samhain/Samhuin?*br*<ScottW> This tale can be found at [http://www.ncf.carleton.ca/~bj333/verse.html#ancient]*br*<Taliesin_2> Does anybody have any thoughts of their own on the topic of Samhain? *br*<IceWa1ker> what IceWalker does for Samhain*br*IceWa1ker has a small ritual (family as he is a Solitary)*br*<IceWa1ker> Insense is burned as an offering to the Gods*br*<IceWa1ker> the ancestors are remembered and offerings made*br*<IceWa1ker> a large meal of harvest type foods is laid on (with pork .. see above)*br*<IceWa1ker> an extra plate is set at the table in the event any ancestor wishes to make an appearance*br*<IceWa1ker> this is to assist in making it known to them that they are welcome, remembered, & respected*br*MysticWlf has to go, thank you for the knowledge.*br*MysticWlf [~Mystical@158.5.14.28] has left #The_Druids'_Grove (Hell is only a word. . . the reality is far worse!!)*br*<IceWa1ker> after the meal*br*Myrriah [~myrriah@as5200-1-41.cnb.mn.frontiernet.net] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> You are welcome. Would you like a copy of the log, Mystic?*br*<IceWa1ker> offerings are again made and the ancestors thanked for their wisdom & assistance in the year past*br*<IceWa1ker> and their help is requested in the upcoming year*br*<VitMonx> back*br*<Taliesin_2> wb VitMonx & Myrriah*br*<ScottW> re Myrriah*br*<VitMonx> thanks*br*<Myrriah> Tal, Scott :-)*br*<OmniSurfer> Thanks all for your help - I must go - catch you all another time!*br*OmniSurfer [~klajn@dialin-004.asgard.net.au] has left #The_Druids'_Grove*br*Tairneanach [gkb000@ftw-tsa7-32.cyberramp.net] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Tairneanach> Feasgar mhath dhuibh a h-uile dhuine*br*<Taliesin_2> Greetings Tairneanach*br*<Tairneanach> How are all of you?*br*<IceWa1ker> fine and dandy ... you?*br*<VitMonx> ping please*br*<Tairneanach> I am well, thanks for asking*br*<Taliesin_2> The chat seems mosdtly to be over.*br*<Taliesin_2> Just keeping on chatting*br*<Tairneanach> 27 seconds*br*<Tairneanach> So did I miss much...did the Samhuinn topic topic go well*br*<VitMonx> thanks Tair*br*<Taliesin_2> Yes, I think so.*br*<Taliesin_2> Very active it was.*br*<VitMonx> brb changing servers*br*<Tairneanach> Good...sorry I couldnt make it sooner*br*<Tairneanach> how many folks participated?*br*<Tairneanach> just got home*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has quit IRC (Quit: going - going - GONE!!!)*br*<Tairneanach> <---- = Greaghoir by the way...from the listserves*br*<IceWa1ker> Got a topic in mind for next week Tal_2?*br*<Taliesin_2> bout 8 at all times*br*VitMonx [yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> Yes. Winter Solstice/Yule/Saturnalia*br*<Taliesin_2> Will be the topic next week*br*<IceWa1ker> I got my dates mixed up, it's NEXT Tuesday that I have to attend a play my daughter is in*br*<Tairneanach> Do you recognize the solstice on the same level that you do the Fire festivals...I do not*br*IceWa1ker thinks it will be loads of fun as it is entirely in French and I can't speak a word*br*<Taliesin_2> NP. I can send you the log if you like....*br*Behomet [behomet@206.251.111.173] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Behomet> Hey Taliesin...You the same guy from the newsgroups?*br*<Behomet> Hiya everyone*br*ScottW grins at Ice*br*<IceWa1ker> I'd really appreciate it altjhough I hope to catch the end of the discussion ... how long can a play last 'eh?*br*<Taliesin_2> Greeting Behomet*br*<Tairneanach> Ta failte' rohmat a Behomet*br*VitMonx [yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has quit IRC (Quit: going - going - GONE!!!)*br*<Tairneanach> Scott...very nice work on the Nemeton page*br*ScottW grins... thanks.*br*<Behomet> Anyone here?*br*<Tairneanach> I ahve added it to the links section of the Clann an Fhaoil-Choin web site*br*VitMonx [~yup@mil-16.dialup.northernnet.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> HYes*br*<Tairneanach> http://www.flash.net/faolcu/*br*<Behomet> Dia is Mhuire Duit. Is mise Scot.*br*Tairneanach is here*br*<IceWa1ker> we're all here Behomet*br*<Taliesin_2> indeed we are.*br*<Behomet> No wonder Christians think we hate them. We treat people like crap... Disappointing =(*br*<VitMonx> man every server I try is lagged*br*Behomet [behomet@206.251.111.173] has left #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<ScottW> That's great, Greaghoir!*br*<Tairneanach> I think thats what was wrong with behomet...lagged and thought we wernt talkin to him*br*<IceWa1ker> where are you located VitM?*br*<Tairneanach> think Im lagged too..*br*<Tairneanach> ping please*br*<ScottW> VitMonx -- try spider.ca.us.dal.net*br*<VitMonx> Minnesota*br*<VitMonx> I'm on spider Scott - usually it's the best*br*<ScottW> 9 secs, Greaghoir.*br*<IceWa1ker> you could try raptor in Alberta*br*<VitMonx> might be my ISP also - we have a running arguement :-)))*br*<Tairneanach> well Ive been MUCH worse off*br*<Taliesin_2> ditto that, here*br*<Taliesin_2> 9 sec*br*<Myrriah> Will BRB everyone*br**** Log file closed: 5/12/98 10:40:02 PM*p**** Log file opened: 5/12/98 10:41:56 PM*br*Taliesin_2 [~shane@shane.cais.com] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*Tairneanach is now known as Greaghoir*br*<Taliesin_2> brb*br*ChanServ sets mode: +o Taliesin_2 *br*<Taliesin_2> ping me?*br*<Greaghoir> I got the rude letter from my isp last week telling me Im streching my hours...*br*VitMonx: YOURPING 13 secs: You are on the protected species list... :-{)*br*<Greaghoir> but they are only 9.99 a month and they give me 20 meg of webspace*br*ScottW has to leave. Thanks for an interesting hour.*br*ScottW [webber@na1p46.ark.com] has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)*br*<IceWa1ker> so .. your stretching your hours ... they charge you extra .. end of story*br*<Greaghoir> Saorsa gu brath SCott...Brighid dhuit*br*<IceWa1ker> 9 sec's Tal_2*br*<VitMonx> My ISP is selling the city to another so I think they don't care anymore*br*<Greaghoir> nope...they tell me if I go over X amount of hours I need to get a dedicated line or somthing 68 bucks a month they want*br*<Myrriah> Back*br*<VitMonx> Also they know that the regional electric co-op is extenting their ISP service to the area*br*<Greaghoir> WB Myrriah...thats a beautiful nick by the way...have allways loved that name*br*IceWa1ker would be quite willing to kill living things for a dedicated connection that only cost 68 bucks (I'd even pay in US dollars !!)*br*<Myrriah> Oh thanks. Have you ever heard the creation story with Niria I just changed it to fit me.*br*<Greaghoir> hahahahahaha*br*<Greaghoir> Where do you live IceWalker?*br*<IceWa1ker> well ... maybe not kill them, but most assuredly I call them nasty names*br*<Myrriah> Mirira I mean, duh!*br*<Greaghoir> Which creation story ?*br*<IceWa1ker> Canada's High Arctic ... Baffin Island*br*<Greaghoir> wow...well welcome*br*<Myrriah> Oh it is pretty long and drawn out. I can't repeat it all here.*br*<Taliesin_2> Sory I've been so silent.*br*Myrriah [~myrriah@as5200-1-41.cnb.mn.frontiernet.net] has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)*br*<Taliesin_2> And me the host...*br*Greaghoir is in Ft Worth Texas...awaiting consecutive days of 100+ heat...summers commin...yuk*br*<Greaghoir> Myr: But whose creation story is it ?*br*Myrriah [~myrriah@as5200-1-41.cnb.mn.frontiernet.net] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*IceWa1ker woke up to snow & wind this morning ... ah well, spring will come soon *br*<Greaghoir> Myr: But whose creation story is it ?*br*<VitMonx> Know what you mean Greag - we will get all the way up to 78 tomorrow lololol*br*<Greaghoir> hahahah...*br*IceWa1ker must go ...*br*<Greaghoir> Vit: and you are located?*br*<IceWa1ker> thanks again Tal_2 ... I love these get togethers*br*<Greaghoir> Saorsa gu brath IceWalker...Brighid dhuit*br*<Myrriah> It is about the Goddess and how she created everything. I could e-mail it to you if you like?*br*<VitMonx> Sunny Minnesota :-)*br*<IceWa1ker> Gone to build something out of stone.... it lasts you know...........*br*IceWa1ker [danu@ppp-194.nunanet.com] has left #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Greaghoir> or ICQ it.*br*<Greaghoir> whose goddess?*br*<Greaghoir> Myr: you on ICQ?*br*<Myrriah> Anyone's use your imagination. Yes I am.*br*<VitMonx> Myrriah - could you mail it to me please - thanks*br*<Greaghoir> Ohh I see.*br*<Myrriah> It is in the class discussion Vit.*br*<VitMonx> k -*br*<Myrriah> ArtSci*br*<Greaghoir> Well we celts dont have a creation myth per say...but I would like to read it none the less*br*<Myrriah> Vit*br*<Greaghoir> Things like that are allways preety cool and interesting*br*<Myrriah> Sure I would be happy to share it, but to do it here would take too much as it is a pretty long story.*br*<Greaghoir> Myr: Do you have ICQ ?*br*Phooka [~pooka@colossus.lightstream.net] has joined #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> Yes. I myself am trying to find the stories of the Gods (generally speaking) on the 'Net*br*<Myrriah> Yes Greaghoir*br*<Phooka> hello all*br*<Taliesin_2> Hey Pkooka*br*<Greaghoir> Failte a Phooka*br*<Myrriah> Tal I will send it to you also. *br*<Phooka> I am trying to include stories or were gods are refrenced to on my pages *br*<Taliesin_2> Thanks!*br*<Taliesin_2> But withn little success on finding them*br*<Phooka> hey guys I got a question do you know of any refrences to bats in the myths*br*<Myrriah> ICQ# Greaghoir is 9461952 Home page is http://www.Myrriah.com just for anyone that is interested <g>*br*<Greaghoir> Phooka: Not in Celtic myth*br*<Phooka> cool, i'll check that out*br*<Taliesin_2> I have only found bare bones refs*br*<Taliesin_2> Try Japanese mythology*br*<Phooka> i had this dream where a bat flew by and then a raven landed on my head*br*<Taliesin_2> There might be a story there relating to bats & dragons. I'm not sure...*br*<Phooka> it's a little more in depth then that but that was the jist of it*br*<Greaghoir> clann an Fhaoil-Choin web site is at http://www.flash.net/faolcu*br*<Greaghoir> my web site is at http://www.cyberramp.net/~gkb000/celtic*br*<Greaghoir> oppps*br*<Greaghoir> http://www.flash.net/~bellbook/faolcu*br*<Greaghoir> some NA traditions have see the bat as dealing with shamanic death*br*<Taliesin_2> When I get my site up it will be at http://www.dc/net/shane1/default.htm*br*<Taliesin_2> When I get my site up it will be at http://www.dc.net/shane1/default.htm*br*<Taliesin_2> Sorry*br*Taliesin_2 changes topic to "Miscellaneous"*br*<Taliesin_2> Um, shall we wrap it up?*br*VitMonx: VitMonx whispers to you... could you e-mail me the log please. My e-mail is wayneh@northernnet.com*br*<Myrriah> Tal can you copy text out of another document to here? Since everyone is interested?*br*<VitMonx> you using win95 Myrriah?*br*<Myrriah> Yes.*br*<Taliesin_2> Could you specify which document you want?*br*<Taliesin_2> You want me to paste the entire log here?*br*<Myrriah> I can either copy it from my e-mail or Word 97*br*<Taliesin_2> I can send it to you in Word 97...*br*<Myrriah> I am just wondering if I can do that or no?*br*<Taliesin_2> VitMonx You have Word 97?*br*<VitMonx> we are talking two diff things here lol*br*<Myrriah> No, Tal I am talking about the creation story that some wanted.*br*Phooka [~pooka@colossus.lightstream.net] has left #The_Druids'_Grove*br*<Taliesin_2> Oh. yeah you can always c'n'paste to the chat room*br*<VitMonx> it can be done Myrriah but need to becareful about flooding*br*<VitMonx> do you have flood limits Tal?*br*<Myrriah> Ok it is coming through then, hang on, Gods if I flood the channel don't get upset ok Tal?*br*<Taliesin_2> NP*br*<Taliesin_2> IT HAPPENS*br*<VitMonx> break it into small pieces Myrriah or dalNET might flood you out*br*<Myrriah> How do I do this Vit? I copied Now how do I paste?*br*<VitMonx> right click and select paste*br*<VitMonx> you didnt copy the whole thing did you?*br*<Myrriah> Helpless female suggests everyone that wants it may e-mail her with request then <g>*br*Greaghoir [gkb000@ftw-tsa7-32.cyberramp.net] has quit IRC (Operation timed out)*br*