Re: ADF & Keltria Searles O'Dubhain Mon Apr 5 19:23:36 1999 I'm a Keltria member and have some experience with ADF as well. To me the differences in the two groups are that Keltria is slightly more flexible about ritual format, while it is less flexible about including mixed panteons of Celtic deities. Keltria also emphasizes Celtic tradition over Indo-European tradition. Otherwise, they are both excellent neo-Druidical organizationns.*p*Here's some information that I posted on alt.religion .druid about Keltria:*p*Keltria was born about 12 years or more ago when some of the members of ADF decided that it was becoming too far removed from the Celtic roots of Drai/ocht. It is one of the fastest growing neo_Druidical groups in the world. I think this is because it establishes certain guidelines for its members that address the principals of Celtic Pagan belief quite well without limiting the individual practices and beliefs of its members unnecessarily.*p*Here are some quotations from the bylaws of The Henge of Keltria website*p*(http://www.magusbooks.com/Keltria):*p*18.1. Keltrian Druidism is an Initiatory Mystery Tradition. Prior to*br*initiation a person must study and prepare for initiation. The uninitiated*br*may go through three phases on the way to initiation. *p*19.1. A pantheon is a family of Gods and Goddesses from a single cultural tradition. Our Groves are free to use any of the Celtic pantheons in their rituals (Irish, Welsh, Scottish, Briton, Gaulish, Cornish, and Manx). Groves must work with a single Celtic pantheon rather than mixing two or more within ritual. We feel that it is easier for students to learn a single set of myths. Pantheons reflect the whole of the ancient culture. When we leave out Gods or Goddesses or mix pantheons, we risk losing certain religious aspects of that culture.*p*19.9.3. The initiation should be a profound experience for the new Druid. It signifies a death of old ways and a rebirth into spiritual awareness. In fact, most initiations work with a motif of symbolic death and rebirth. Often, during the event, the answers to some of the "Great Mysteries" will be revealed to the candidate. The vehicle for this revelation can be either the Gods or the Initiating Druid of the group. Some traditions may also use this time to reveal the "secrets," hidden knowledge held exclusively by the group or the tradition. Frequently the candidate will be put to a test. This could be a test of knowledge, courage, trust, or endurance. Any oaths that are required by the tradition will be taken at this time.*p*19.9.8. Being an initiatory path does not intone that we have an unbroken tradition dating back to pre-historic times. Few, if any, of the Neopagan traditions can truly make such a claim. Our initiation signifies that a person has been accepted into the mystery path, and has gained sufficient knowledge and skills to be called a Keltrian Druid.*p*********br*There's much more to the bylaws than that. I've only quoted a small sampling. They have a grove system and a training course as well as a generalized ritual format that can be tailored to the needs of the individual groves. In addition to that, they also have some basic teachings about Drai/ocht (*again, from the website):*p*What are the other beliefs of Keltrian Druidism? *p*The following set of statements encompass the major points of our values and worldview: *p*標e believe in Divinity as it is manifest in the Pantheon. There are several valid theistic perceptions of this Pantheon. *br*標e believe that nature is the embodiment of the Gods. *br*標e believe that all life is sacred and should neither be harmed nor taken without deliberation or regard. *br*標e believe in the immortality of the spirit. *br*標e believe that our purpose is to gain wisdom through experience. *br*標e believe that learning is an ongoing process and should be fostered at all ages. *br*標e believe that morality should be a matter of personal conviction based upon self respect and respect for others. *br*標e believe that individuals have the right to pursue enlightenment through his or her chosen path. *br*標e believe in a living religion able to adapt to a changing environment. We recognize that our beliefs may undergo change as our tradition grows. *p*********br*I recommend The Henge of Keltria as a place where Druids can gather, learn, grow, practice and work together to become a force in the life of the worlds.*br*-- *br*Searles O'Dubhain*p**br*Taliesin_2 wrote,*br*: Greetings I'm here writing this possibly inflamatory post to *br*: help me decide which of the two orders to join. I would like *br*: to hear both the good and the bad about both and a list of *br*: Pros and Cons of them. All I ask is that you be honest in *br*: your statements. Thank you.*br* ADF & Keltria Taliesin_2 340 Thu Apr 1 00:14:46 1999 http://www.magusbooks.com/Keltria The Henge of Keltria Website